Q. What level of funding do you believe Oklahoma’s K-12 public schools need, and as State Superintendent, what would you do to advocate for funding?
John Cox: “Okay. So, actually, four years ago — and this is just based upon what I see in my school and the money that flows in our districts. But it was around $400 million around four years ago.
“And what I’ve been estimating is about $200 million additional dollars — and not earmarked dollars — but additional dollars would help us to at least stay even for right now.
“But it’s a moving target every year too. Just, you know, and y’all know what we’re going through with inflation and increased costs in everything.
“Just bus diesel itself. So that’s a moving target.
“But I would conservatively say $200 million would put us – everybody asks that question, what is that real amount that public education needs. And so – I didn’t see that in the budget this year and so that’s something that I will really have to advocate for and explain why we need that, why our kids need that in our schools.
“And so I think that’s what the value I bring to the table, is that I live this every day and I see the funding that needs to be internally in our teachers’ classrooms. And so – so, yeah, that’s a really good, I think, guestimate amount.
“But it is the State Superintendent’s job to really lay it out there and say, ‘This is why we need it.’ Just, you know, in the past, we’ve always said, ‘Well, we need more money; we need more cash.’
“And then the other argument is to say, ‘Well, we just don’t need to be throwing money at it. You just don’t throw money at a problem.’
“But I’ve always say you have to give us a chance. And, you know – and I know we’ll talk about vouchers here in a little bit. But you just can’t give your money away and expect to do better.
“So yeah, advocacy in the State Superintendent for appropriate funding and really the explanations of that and convincing legislators. I think that is the real key, to convince them that the need for that money.
“And I have really good relationships with I would say quite a few of our legislators and even the ones in key positions. So I see that pretty much as a smooth transition going in.”
Q. Do you support using public funds for tuition for private schools?
John Cox: “You know, I don’t. The reason I don’t – and, you know, I’ve been criticized in Tulsa for saying that, because I look at that as voucher. I mean, it’s called other things. I just look at that as giving money away that we need to he able to use to fix our schools or enhance or help our schools.
“I use the word ‘fix,’ because even in my school district, I always think there’s things we can tweet and we can get better at and we can fix. So I’ve been using ‘fix” and ‘correct’ a lot. But no.
“And I’ve been trying to find an eloquent way to say this, but if you’re running a business and people come in your door and you give them a voucher to go down to the store down beside you, eventually you’re going to go out of business. Because you have to retain the money you have to fix what you have.
“And so I’m trying to figure out a way to say that for people who are for vouchers because, you know, Ryan Walters thinks, Man, just give them the money. That will cure public education. Just give parents – it will drain us, it will drain my school out here.
“I really expect to be successful at this campaign and be in there January the 1st, but I love Peggs School and I don’t want anything to ever happen to it. And just every dollar that goes out to a private entity takes away from my school.
“It’s really the concept of all the money’s in the pot. So are we going to reduce the pot to, you know, to help our schools out? I just think it’s the wrong direction to in.
“That was a long answer for a very short question.”
Q. As State Superintendent, what would you do to recruit and retain a larger number of high-quality teachers and education support professionals in Oklahoma? You just talked about retirement and gap year insurance. What other ideas or suggestions do you have?
John Cox: “You know, I think the message really has to change and I think those of us – and of course, I’m talking about you and me – in the business, we have to do a better job of encouraging our own families to be in education.
“I have five children, after watching me all these years, have decided they’re going in another direction. And I see that everywhere that I go.
“So the message has to change that being -having a servant’s heart and being in public ed, it is extremely important. It’s important for everything because the way the foundation.
“So the message has to change. I have to do a really good job when I get in there to do a statewide public relations campaign to really give the voice of the teacher out there to let young people, 17-, 18-year-olds, really know that, hey, this is pretty cool. It’s really neat to be a teacher and help other people.
“But also, we’re going to have to look at -because realistically, 18-year-olds are looking about, ‘How can I make money? Do I have to go four years to make $40,000 when I can get out right now and work at fast food and make 35,000?’
“I don’t remember if I was at Panda Express or somewhere, but they have assistant manager, $47,000. No college. And I’m thinking wow, what do all these teachers out there think about that?
“And so — okay, so I think eight years ago, I was saying we were at $32,000, I said we need to be at $40,000. But right now I’m out there saying the baseline should be $50,000 now for an entry-level teacher. And I think that is right at the level at this point in time where that entices a young person to go, hey, that’s a good wage, I’d love to be a teacher and I can make a living. It’s not a great living but I can make a living doing that.
“And then, also it’s been talked about, like, every five years on the scale, if it doesn’t stay at the 400 and, what, $20 or something like that. If it doesn’t stay at that but it bumps up, you know, even $1,000 or $1,500, every five years, that gives a teacher an incentive to go if I get to five years, I’ll get another increase. A significant.
“I don’t think teachers really see the increase when you go $332 or $400 a year because it just fades away into the paycheck. So I think they have to see that visually.
“But I think we’re in crisis mode. Y’all realize that, right? Because I think 1,200 grades this year in the teacher of ed and over 3,500 projected to leave us. And so we got to work real hard to get some of those to come back and we got to figure out how can we streamline the process for certification.
“And so I see on lots of committees, lot of scholarship committees. And one of the ladies, outstanding senior at NSU, she was telling us that her friends, early on and freshman, sophomore year at college, were saying they didn’t want to — they had to pay all these fees to be a teacher, so they went another direction. She became a teacher.
“But let’s figure out all these fees that we’re doing and are the tests viable? So I was really excited when we got rid of the OGET test. And being from old school, I took one test per subject area. That’s all I did. I took one calculus test -that’s it – in order to teach that class, took one basic math test for that, one psychology test.
“So why can’t we go back to that? Even though – I mean, I felt it was redundant to earn a math degree and then have to go take all these math tests to say I actually deserved that I had a math degree.
“So maybe there’s a better way to do that instead of just making people pay lots of money. And then we’re doing this PPAT thing now which is costing our kids $300 and something, when the college of eds are already doing that process through their internship.
“And so we’re doing it twice all in one thing but just making our students pay the extra $300 that they don’t have.
“So, I don’t even know if I answered the question, I talked so long so …”
Q. What is your position on educating the whole child?
John Cox: “You know, I’m a – and this seems really old-school – but I’m a Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs person. I really believe in that.
“And, you know, being out in rural area where our poverty level’s right around 77%. And we have a lot of grandparents taking care of kids and then also parents who – both parents are working to survive, you know.
“So, I view every child as my child that comes in these doors. And so even my own children, we looked at supporting the whole child. So, I look at it from that angle, if that answers your question.
“I think we need to do everything we can to help a child regardless of what it is. You know, if they need — if they’re a little kindergartner snot-nose and they — you happen to be wearing slacks or suit that day and they come up and rub all over you and put the snot on you, I just think that’s part of it, you know.
“So the loves and the basic needs have to be met before anybody can ever get to the level of self-actualization. I just believe in those steps.
“If you miss a step, you’re not ever going to get there.
“And so, the basic needs are extremely important to what we do for every — every child.
Q. So, Dr. Cox, I have a followup to that. Is there anything specific that you see that we’re not doing to address the whole child that you would like to implement as State Superintendent to help move that forward?
John Cox: “You know, I think we’re doing everything that we can possibly. I mean, it may not be something that’s seen. It’s just something that our – is intrinsic in teachers and I think school administrators that – we just do things. We do things that people don’t see.
“And so I just think our schools need more support to help in those areas. And we talk about more funding; but as dollars come in, it gives us flexibility to be able to help with those needs.
“And those are needs that people don’t see and nobody outside of our groups would not really understand that. But I can’t think of a specific thing.
“But in general, you know, we just need the resources to – when that child comes in the school and they’ve got head lice and you know that if you send them home, they’re going to be home two or three days; but hey, if we go ahead and wash them right here and take care of it so they can stay at school. But then where do we get the product?
“You know, and that’s a very tiny thing. That’s things that nobody sees. Nobody sees when I bring a child in here and put in front of my window so the sunlight can hit their hair. And y’all know what I’m talking about. But nobody sees that. But that is treating the whole child and trying to take care of them as your own.
“So, resources are vital important. And I think that’s what the beauty of me being in the position of state superintendent, it’s really that I understand that.
“And that when I walk into a school district, you know, I can see the things that might need to be done, but I can also see the things that are being done behind the scenes.”
